A Clue! A Clue?: The Quest for Michael Stumpf Continues

In a previous blog post I located multiple pieces of potential evidence for my great-great-grandfather Michael Stumpf, who left Austria-Hungary to go to the U.S. in 1907 and whose fate is unknown.  It turns out there are a lot of Michael Stumpfs running around the early 1900s in northeast U.S! I eliminated evidence as belonging to different Michael Stumpfs, leaving only one potential clue: the 1910 North Tonawanda, Niagara County, New York census. 

I have been unsuccessful finding anything for him until...

A European Incoming Passenger List

While attending a genealogy meeting [1] with Kate Townsend presenting "Follow the Records and See Where They Go!" I became aware of a dataset called "UK and Ireland, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960" in Ancestry.  Not expecting anything, I checked for Michael Stumpf and was rewarded with an entry!

Fig. 1. Screen grab of Ancestry's entry for Mihaele Stumpf in "U.K. and Ireland Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1920"

Here's the info:

• Ship Victorian of the Canadian Pacific Ocean Services Ltd. Steamship Line 
• Departed from St. John, New Brunswick, Canada
• Arrived in Liverpool, England on 3 Jan 1921
• Mihaele Stumpf in transit to Hungary
• Labourer / age 58 (est birth 1863) / citizen of Hungary / last permanent residence in U.S.A.
• There's a number 2 on the list after the "In Transit to Budapest, Hungary" tick marks. Does this mean anything or just a stray keystroke?

This could be my Michael.  There isn't any other data to distinguish him from other Hungarian Michael Stumpfs and since he is traveling alone, family members weren't there to be clues.  

Also on ship continuing on to Budapest is Gyorgy Surnyak, from Battonya who went to US in 1905.  Researching him did not yield any clues to Michael.

I checked the U.S. to Canada Border Crossing dataset in Ancestry, and did not find Michael there.  There's no departing passenger data on the Canadian side. There are no records for train travel in Europe or from the U.K.  I checked for newspapers in Liverpool and in St. John, New Brunswick, but didn't find any clues.

If Michael returned to Hungary in 1921, that means he:

• Spent 1907 to 1920 in the U.S., possibly including April 1910 in North Tonawanda, NY when he was unemployed.
• Spent WWI 1914 to 1919 in the U.S.
• Probably stuck because of the war
• That's 13 years.  Where was he?!!

Frustration Continues

Not quite ready to call this a success.  I'm not sure what evidence I would need to confirm it, but if I find him back in Hungary after 1921, that's a good sign it is him.

P.S. Death Notice for Michael Stumpf's Wife, Theresia Ritter! 

Someone on one of the Banat/Donauschwaben mailing lists shared about a digital archive Bibliothek des Digitalen Forums Mittel- und Osteuropa.  They have digitized and made searchable newspapers among other things. There I found the death notice for Therese Ritter in the Temesvarer Zeitung on 01 Aug 1923! [2]  It is in German:

In der Vorstadt Josefstadt ist in einer Waggonwohnung am Bahnhofe die Witwe Michael Stumpf geb. Therese Ritter im Alter von 65 Jahren gestorben.

[In the Josefstadt district, in a wagon apartment at the train station, the widow of Michael Stumpf, née Therese Ritter, 65 years of age, has died.]

A summary of the details: 

• Therese Ritter, widow of Michael Stumpf
• died on 1 Aug 1923, or maybe 31 or 30 Jul 1923?, in the Josefstadt neighborhood of Timisoara
• She lived/died in a train car apartment at the train station
• She was Roman Catholic

I didn't even know she had lived in Timisoara. Waggonwohnung am Bahnhofe is an old train carriage used as apartments.  And, a clue about Michael; he had died before Aug 1923.  ...Or, he never returned to Theresia and was assumed deceased.

Footnotes

[1] I encourage the attendance of genealogy meetings. Join your local society and attend the meetings.  You never know when you'll learn about a key resource, a new tool or technique, or just get some inspiration. Attending or watching online meetings or lectures is good too.

[2] "Todesfälle." Temesvarer Zeitung. 1 August 1923. Das Digitale Forum Mittel- und Osteuropa (DiFMOE). difmoe.eu : 2023.

Update to the Brick Wall of Johann Stumpf

I busted a brick wall!!

Background

In my third blog post, "This Side of the Brick Wall of Johann Stumpf," I lay out my journey to the brick wall of who are Johann Stumpf's parents.  I list my sources of information and what they tell me and lament the missing records that could solve my mystery.  I conclude with my best guess as to who are the parents of Johann Stumpf.

New Access to Archival Records

Snippet of map used to navigate to villages and their archive holdings in the Presentation of Church Register of the Archives of Vojvodina. Displayed in Cyrillic Serbian, lower left is Zrenjanin (Großbetschkerek); Klek is to the northeast, then Ravni Topolovac (Kathreinfeld) and Žitište (St. Georgen am Bega).

The Archives of Vojvodina has digitized the church books of the Vojvodina region, including Serbian Banat, and made them available online in their Presentation of Church Registers web portal.  You need to register to use the site and search the images, but it’s free to do so.  Also, currently, it is necessary to use their Cyrillic Serbian version, but Google Translate will put the page into English.  Oh, and I needed to turn off my touch screen capabilities in order to zoom in on the images.  The gap years still exist, but I am able to view all the pages myself and can gather all the Stumpf entries for my Database of Stumpfs in Kathreinfeld and Klek in the Banat.

Method for my Madness

In order to add Stumpf individuals to my RootsMagic database from St. Georgen, I went through all the Catholic church books available for the village, first the marriages, then the baptisms, then the deaths.  The years available for this village were roughly 1862 to 1895, with 1868-1869 and 1874-1880 missing.  I kept notes in Microsoft’s OneNote note taking program for each year I searched and the result.  I was able to construct a few families, add missing children, and connect children I had with their parents in my database.  I was also able to find the parents for Michael Rager who made an appearance in Benjamin Moore's book The Names of John Gergen (see post "A Book Review, Mike Rager & St. Louis Stumpfs").  I was pleased with myself and better understood how to navigate the website and the church books.

Getting Results

Then I moved on to Klek.  But instead of starting at 1850 and going through the books like I did for St. Georgen, I jumped to 1862 to see what was there.  I am looking for my Michael Stumpf, the son of Johann Stumpf and Katharina Hoffman, who was born around 1862 or 1863 as well as his parent’s marriage.  Katharina was from Klek, and Michael was born in Klek, but Johann is from Kathreinfeld as are Michael’s siblings, so the family settled there.  I have had researchers in Serbia look at the books a few years ago and they didn’t find him.  The solution was that Johann and Katharina must have been married and Michael born in Klek in the 1858-1861 gap years in which the church books are missing.

Well, I found no marriage in Klek for the couple in 1862 or 1863.  Jumping over to the baptisms - lo and behold, I find Michael, illegitimate son of Catharina Hoffman, born in 1863!  There he is right there!

Katharina and Johann weren’t married yet when Michael was born!!  Well, that explains why he wasn't found as the son of Johann Stumpf.

Now I’m excited and no way am I waiting.  I jump over to the Kathreinfeld church books, go to the marriage book for 1863, and bam! There they are.  And their parents are listed!!  Oh happy day!

So who are the parents of Johann Stumpf and Katarina Hoffman?  I made guesses, I looked at the families available and the known Johanns and Katarinas in the villages to puzzle out which ones were mine. 

But no, Johann’s parents listed in the marriage entry didn't make sense.  There was another Johann who married a Katharina Jenisch (another Katharina), who goes with these parents.  Could they have been two Johanns from that family? One after the other, or twins?  No, that doesn’t make sense.  I go to the marriage of the other Johann in the church book in the following year and find out he has been assigned to the wrong family in the Kathreinfeld family book!  Johann Stumpf who married Katharina Jenisch is the son of Johann Stumpf and Anna Maria Putz.

So there we have it.  My Johann is the son of Michael Stumpf and Margaretha Kollinger!  So now I can  track our exact lineage back to Melchior Stumpf who came to the Banat with his brother Jakob in 1764, and who came from Dörlesberg in Baden!

Katharina Hoffman is the daughter of Johann Hoffman and Marianna Salmon.  I thought this might be the right family for her out of the 3 eligible Katharina Hoffmans in Klek who were about the right age.  She's listed in the Lazarfeld & Klek family book [1] in her parents' family with some siblings, but the parents' parents weren't listed.  Here is my final note as I was puzzling it out: 

This is also probably the right Katharina because no decent info is given on the parents.  She'd fit right in.  :/

What's next?

I worked with limited scraps of information to puzzle out Michael's parents for 12 years, and then 5 more years for Johann's parents!  Seventeen years!? To paraphrase Inigo Montoya [2], I've been in the research business so long, now that it's over, I don't know what to do with the rest of my life. 

Well, maybe that's an exaggeration.

My RootsMagic Stumpf database is updated, straightening out the Johanns.  I'm committed to getting the Stumpf families all sorted.  Next steps are to go through the archive's records for Klek and Kathreinfeld, scouring them for Stumpf entries.  I'll note the corrections on the CompGen wiki page for corrections to the Kathreinfeld family book as appropriate, especially the families of the two Johanns.  I'll update my Stumpfs of Kathreinfeld and Klek online database as well and perhaps some of my blog posts.

My remaining big mystery is: when and where did their son, Michael Stumpf, die? Oh, and where was he when he was in the U.S. from 1907 until either he died or returned to Europe?

Footnotes:

[1] Kühn, Josef. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Lazarfeld im Banat : und ihrer Filialen Klel (KkL.) und Jankahid (Jhd.): 1800-1834/1852. Villingen-Schwenningen, Germany: Josef Kühn und Arbeitsgemeinschaft für Veröffentlichung Banater Familienbücher, 2004.

[2] Inigo Montoya is a character in The Princess Bride. If you didn't know this, please watch the movie, it's a classic.

Franz, His Son Franz, and Another Franz: Untangling Some Franzes

Besides outright missing information, in the process of gathering all the Stumpfs I can find in the Zrenjanin area, I also come across conflicting information. People becoming tangled up with each other usually because of a shared name and lack of information.

Here’s a case study on untangling some information and errors across several family books. I am by no means being critical of the authors of the family books. The records available and the clues they have to work with must result in a frustrating and nearly impossible job. I treat the family books as a presentation of the best that could be determined at the time the information was being collated and organized. Sometimes, probably always, better information comes to light later after the book has been published. 

Meet the Franzes 

There is some confusion with several Franz Stumpfs. I will number them out and describe them so we can try to sort them out. Their names appear in the records as Franz, Franciscus, and Ferencz, but I will be referring to them as Franz. 

Figure 1. List of Franz Stumpfs in Trish's "Stumpf of Kathreinfeld and Klek in the Banat" database. Numbering will identify the Franzes for this discussion. Red dots are the ones that have overlapping/conflicting information about them. 

These Franzes have mixed up information in the family books: 

Franz #1 

• unknown birthdate and birth place;
• unknown parents; 
• married Eva Klein and had lots of kids together;
• second marriage to Magdalena Brax (see discussion below);
• unknown death date. 
• He was mentioned in "Brick Walls and Loose Branches: Stumpf Men with Unknown Parentage."

Franz #2 

• born 12 Oct 1843 in Kathreinfeld; 
• the son of Franz #1 and Eva Klein. 
• His adult life is unknown, 
• although he was likely a witness to his father's second marriage 
• (see discussion below). 

Franz #3 

• born 12 Nov 1843 in Kathreinfeld; 
• son of Michael Stumpf and Margaretha Kollinger; 
• married Elisabeth Scheidnast;
• died in 1917 according to Grossbetschkerek family book (see discussion below).

These are some other Franzes: 

Franz #4 

• born in 1822 in Kathreinfeld;
• the son of Peter Stumpf and Anna Maria Neurohr;
• he married Margaretha Geser in 1842 
• had a bunch of kids at the same time as Franz #1. 
• unknown death date;
• was also in Kathreinfeld;
• definitely a different person than Franz #1.
• He doesn’t have any mysteries and everything seems in order. 

Franz #5 

• his birth is guess-timated at 1848; 
• has unknown parents; 
• married Anna Rein; 
• had kids in Kathreinfeld; 
• he died in Kathreinfeld in 1923. 
• He was also mentioned in "Brick Walls and Loose Branches: Stumpf Men with Unknown Parentage." 

I won’t discuss the other unnumbered Franzes in the list (Figure 1), because they are all connected to their families and everything seems in order. 

Which Franz was this? 

These are two facts that are attributed to more than one Franz: 

• One Franz married Magdalena Brax/Prax
• One Franz died in 1917 in Kathreinfeld

From the Mixed-up Family Groups of the Family Books 

The Kathreinfeld Family Book (Queiser)

Franz #1 definitely married Eva Klein and had at least nine children together, but probably more. Franz #1 and Eva Klein’s birth, parents, and marriage details are unknown. Their first child is named Franz (Franz #2 in this discussion) who was born in 1843, and according to this listing, died in 1917 in Kathreinfeld. Eva Klein and their ninth child, Jakob, died in October 1868 in Kathreinfeld after his birth. 

Figure 2. Queiser’s Kathreinfeld family book. 

What’s kind of interesting about this entry is that for this book, only births up to 1841 were available, but here we have births from 1843 to 1859. Usually only children who died were known about for this time period, which is probably how Jakob is known. Also, marriages were available, yet no marriage was entered, so perhaps the couple married elsewhere. There is a gap between Anton, born 1859, and Jakob, born 1868. There are likely a few more kids in these intervening nine years.

Bonus: A Question about Eva Klein

One thing that bugged me about this entry, though, is that Eva Klein's estimated birth is 1832, yet her first son was born in 1843. Surely, she was not 11 years old. This made me question whether Eva was really the wife of Franz #1.

The estimated birth year is from her death record, which claims she was 36 years old when she died in 1868. Most certainly, her age was misrepresented at the time of her death. Her birth year would be better guess-timated as 1823, if she is indeed Franz #2's mother, which I am not questioning.

Figure 3. Eva Klein's death entry. (Római Katólikus Egyház [Roman Catholic Church] (Katalinfalva), FHL Film 1190308, digital image no. 607)

The Deutsch Elemer Family Book (Leitl & Müller)

Figure 4. Deutsch Elemer family book by Leitl & Müller

The Deutsch Elemer family book, shows Franz #1 and Eva Klein's daughter Barbara died in 1875 at the age of 10. Although this daughter Barbara is not listed in the Kathreinfeld family book, there is a gap in that family group from 1859 to 1868. She likely fits in this gap with a birth around 1865.

This entry also lists Franz #1 re-married in 1870 to the widow Magdalena Brax. Given Magdalena Brax’s birthdate, everything looks in order. Franz #1’s estimated birth year should be earlier than the 1842 guess in this entry. I would guess closer to 1822.

Also note, a witness to the marriage is Franciscus Stumpf, most likely his son, Franz #2. 

So far, so good, right? 

Some Confusion from the Grossbeschkerek Family Book with Ms. Brax 

Figure 5. Franz #3 in the Grossbetschkerek family book (Leitl & Müller), page 1964.

This listing for Franciscus Stumpf in the Grossbetschkerek family book is for Franz #3 and his family. His parents and birthdate are listed correctly and he has a death date of 1917, very similar to Franz #2's death date in the Katreinfeld family book (Figure 2). 

Here he is listed with a first wife of Magdalena Prax. This most definitely the Magdalena Brax who married Franz #1 in Deutch Elemer in 1870. Ms. Brax shouldn’t be listed here with Franz #3. 

Franz #3 married Elisabeth Schettneisz/Scheidnast in 1876 in Grossbetschkerek and they had some kids in Kathreinfeld. 

Which Franz died in 1917 in Kathreinfeld?

Figure 6. Franz #3 in the Kathreinfeld family book (Egert)

The Kathreinfeld family book entry (Figure 2) shows Franz #2 with a death date of 17 Feb 1917 in Kathreinfeld. The Grossbetschkerek family book (Figure 5) and the Kathreinfeld family book (Figure 6) shows Franz #3 with a death date of 17 Dec 1917 in Kathreinfeld.

Let’s see if we can determine which one this actually is! 

Checking the church records for Kathreinfeld for 1917:

• it was actually Franz #3 who died in 17 Dec 1917, correctly stated in the Grossbetschkerek and Egert's family books
• there is no death entry for 17 February 1917, 
• so that was probably a typo along with attributing it to the wrong Franz. 
• To further add to the ease of confusion, both Franz #2 and Franz #3 were both born a few months apart in 1843, so the same age.
• Queiser wouldn't have had access to Franz #3's marriage record in Grossbetschkerek, so he wouldn't know which Franz had married Elisabeth.

Figure 7. Kathreinfeld church book entry for death of Franz Stumpf, husband of Elisabeth Scheidnast.
(Heiligen Antonius von Padua [St. Anthony of Padua] Catholic Church)

(I should say for some reason, I started out thinking the dates were the same and therefore one was attributed to the wrong Franz, but later realized the dates were for February and December. My confusion actually paid off though.)

Could Franz #2 be Franz #4? 

It is assumed that Franz #2 was the witness to his father Franz #1’s marriage in 1870. But what happened to him? We also have Franz #5, who is married to Anna Rein and had some kids in Kathreinfeld, but his parents are unknown. His birth is guess-timated at 1848 and he died in Kathreinfeld in 1923. Franz #2 with a birthdate of 1843 is not out of the question to be Franz #5. 

Figure 8. Kathreinfeld family book (Egert), p. 272.

Two of their children not listed here were found in the Sarscha church books. Lorenz, born 1876, married Anna Vidt. Katalin, born 1880, married Mathias Kichler. Franz #4 and Anna Rein very likely have other children born before that. 

Given that 1843 is at the beginning of the "gap-iness" of records, and Franz #4 and Anna's marriage and all their children's baptisms all happened in those locked up gap years, a search of the church records in the archives in Zrenjanin would be needed to find absolute proof of Franz #4's parentage. Without that, I don't feel confident that I can assert Franz #2 and Franz #4 are absolutely the same person. I also might be missing other potential candidates. But, there are no other working hypotheses at this time.

Closing 

I hope this was mildly interesting as a case study, even if you don't descend from any of these Franzes. I don't. They were just bugging me by messing up my database. 

And of course if you, dear reader, have information to add to the puzzle, please let me know.

Sources Used:

Egert, Roswitha, compiler. Familienbuch der katholischen pfarrgemeinde Kathreinfeld im Banat: 1893/1895/1915-1947 (Teil 2). Villingen-Schwennigen: Herausgegeben von der Arbeitsgemeinschaft für Veröffentlichung Banater Familienbücher (AVBF), 2006.

Heiligen Antonius von Padua [St. Anthony of Padua] Catholic Church (Kathreinfeld, Torontal, Austria-Hungary). "Church Books." Historic Archive Of Zrenjanin, Zrenjanin, Serbia.

Leitl, Marco and Rudolph Müller. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Deutsch-Elemer im Banat sowie ihrer Filialen: 1790-1944. N.p.: Norderstedt: Books on Demand, 2007.

Leitl, Marco and Rudolph Müller, compilers. Familienbuch der katholischen pfarrgemeinde der stadt Gross Betschkerek im Banat: 1753-1945. 2 volumes. Munich: M. Leitl, 2016.

Queiser, Josef, compiler. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Kathreinfeld-St. Georgen a/Bega (und ihrer Filialen): im jugoslawischen Banat 1795-1841/1873. Sindelfingen, Germany: Arbeitskreis Donauschwäbischer Familienforscher (AKdFF), 1997.

Római Katólikus Egyház [Roman Catholic Church] (Katalinfalva, Torontál, Hungary). Anyakönyvek [Church Books], 1795-1873. Digitized Microfilm. Family History Library, Salt Lake City, Utah, http:/familysearch.org : 2017.

,

Other Villages Full of Stumpfs: Stumpf Settlers in the Banat Determined to Not Be Related to Jakob and Melchior

A Disambiguation Project 

With the thought that I might find some of the sons of Jakob and Melchior who only have birth info, I set out locating other villages with Stumpf families to determine their Stumpf founders.  What I found were other villages full of Stumpfs. Identifying and eliminating candidates is also helpful. This is a list of villages, in annotated bibliography format, with Stumpfs whose founders didn’t have any connections back to Jakob and Melchior, who were in the Zrenzanin/Großbetschkerek region of Vojvodina. I have included the citation for the sources I used as well as my thoughts and my unvetted conclusions. The research here was quick and not comprehensive, but, I hope, accurate. 

Visit the Focus & Locations tab for a map.

General Sources mentioned in the following analyses

Some of the sources listed here I obtained by visiting the Family History Library (now the FamilySearch library, I think) in Salt Lake City, Utah.  Others I obtained by using their remote look-up service. [1]  Still others were available online and I have included a hyperlink for convenience.

Stader, Stefan, compiler. Sammelwerk Donauschwäbischer Kolonisten. 9 volumes. Sindelfingen, Germany: Donauschwäbischer Familienforscher, 1997-2017.

A nine volume work started by Stefan Stader and completed posthumously. Entries are on individuals identified from various sources as immigrating to the Banat from central Europe. Sources used include settler lists for Banat villages, the registration in Vienna, and village family books that had been compiled before this work was completed. There are 20 Stumpf and Stumph entries.  I will refer to this as Stader's Sammelwerk.

Connor, Martha Remer, transcriber. Germans & Hungarians: 1828 Land Census. 25 volumes. [Las Vegas]: M.R. Connor, 1991.

The 1828 Hungarian Land Census was transcribed by Martha Remer Connor. This census only lists land owners and not every resident.  Volume 3 is Torontal County, volume 5 is Temes County, and volume 14 is Arad County. Available online as digitized books at FamilySearch.

Billed & Detta: Vilhelm/Wilhelm Stumpf

Wilhelm and Caspar in Billed

Wikete, Hans, compiler. Ortsippenbuch Billed: 1765-2000. Online. Heimathaus Billed. https://www.heimathaus-billed.de/geschichte/ortssippenbuch/159-daten-a-z : 2021.

There are many Stumpf families in Billed. Vilhelm seems to be the oldest and first (family no. s1360), so suspect others are related, or, likely descended. Although the Billed family book does not list children for him, there is a Casper (family no. s1365) born abt 1775 that could be his, and two of Casper's sons are there with families.

The first Stumpf event in Billed is in 1802 when Vilhelm's wife, Catharina, dies. Vilhelm remarries in 1803 (to a widow named Catharina) and Casper also gets married in 1803.

Vilhelm's birth is estimated as 1753 from age 60 at death. (The wife that died in 1802 is estimated to have been born in 1738, 15 years older! Is this the inaccuracies of estimated age at death or a lack of prospective brides in early 1700s Banat?  Probably the former.)

There are two Stumpf men in the 1828 Census for Billed: Joseph and Caspar.

A different or the same Wilhelm in Detta? 

There is a Wilhelm Stumpf (55174) in Stader’s Sammelwerk who was in Detta in 1762.

Arbeitskreis donauschwäbischer Familienforscher (AKdFF). "Ortsfamilienbuch Detta." Online family book. Verein für Computergenealogie e.V. (CompGen). Genealogy.net. https://online-ofb.de/detta/: 2021.

The online family book for Detta lists a Wilhelm Stumpf who might have married the widow Barbara in 1762 in Detta; the location isn't clear in the online family book. They had a son, Johann, in 1768 and the wife Barbara died in 1775. Could this be the same Wilhelm as in Billed? If it is, the estimated birth of 1753 is off and it would be earlier by about 10 years, which would better line up with the spouse Catharina's age at death mentioned in the Billed analysis.

Conclusion: This Wilhelm (if the same man) or these Wilhelms (if different men) are not descended from Jakob nor Melchior. The Stumpf families in Billed and Detta can be eliminated from the puzzle of Jakob and Melchior’s descendants.

Kleinjetscha

A different Wilhelm:

Giel, Dietmar, compiler. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Kleinjetscha im Banat: 1772-2000. Karlsruhe, Germany: HOG Kleinjetscha, 2001.

There is also a Wilhelm Stumpf listed in the Kleinjetscha settlers list. He is the only Stumpf listed in the Kleinjetscha family book. Kleinjetscha isn't far from Billed. He is from "Uttenheim/Pfalz." He died in Kleinjetscha in 1788. Uttenheim is now in Lorraine near the border with Pfalz.

Could this be the same as the Vilhelm/Wilhelm discussed above? He could have been in Detta by 1762 until 1775 moved to Kleinjetscha in 1788 and moved to Billed by 1802, perhaps? Oh, except the Kleinjetscha Wilhelm died in 1788. Never mind.

Conclusion: This Wilhelm is not descended from Jakob nor Melchior. Note the origin of Uttenheim in case it comes into play when finding the origin of Jakob and Melchior.

Kudritz

Heimatortsgemeinschaft. Kudritz: 1742-1910. Work in Progress. Gross-Scham: 2021. Pdf file in 2 parts. Genealogie - HOG Groß-Scham. http://clandata.sytes.net/wordpress/genealogie/ : 2021.

The Stumpfs from Kudritz descend from Andreas, born abt 1709, place unknown. He is also in the Sammelwerk by Stader.

Andreas had 3 sons: one son who died in infancy, one son had 3 daughters, one son's fate is unknown ("JoesLudw").

Conclusion: These Stumpfs do not descend from Jakob or Melchior. Since the origin of Andreas is unknown, it is not known if related in "the old country," but he is at least a generation older than Jakob and Melchior.

Liebling

Heimatortsgemeinschaft. Liebling Eine Gemeinde im Banat: 1786-1910. Work in Progress. Gross-Scham: 2021. Pdf file. Genealogie - HOG Groß-Scham. http://clandata.sytes.net/wordpress/genealogie/ : 2022.

The Stumpfs in Liebling descend from Johann Georg Stumpf, born about 1750 in Nieder Saulheim. First Stumpf event in Liebling was the marriage of a son in 1806.

There are two entries in the Sammelwerk by Stader for Johann Georgs, not sure if either/both are the Johan Georg who went to Liebling. Both registered in Vienna in 1786. One entry (55161) says his wife and kids will follow, registered in July, and is joining his brother who went to Hungary. The other entry (55162) registered in May with wife and two daughters and a mother-in-law .

In the 1828 Hungarian Land Census index, there is a Christian, a Tobias, and a Jacob Stumpf listed.

There are pages of descendants in the Liebling family book.

Conclusion: The Johann Georg(s) in Sammelwerk by Stader immigrated in 1786, whereas Jakob and Melchior immigrated in 1764, 22 years earlier. Seems like too long of a time for a brother to follow. The Liebling Stumpfs are not descended from Jakob or Melchior. There is the potential to be related or from the same place.

Sanktmartin & Elek

Fackelmann, Bernhard. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Sanktmartin im Arader Komitat (1724-1992) : und deren Filialen Matscha und Kurtitsch (bis 1920) sowie die dazugehörigen Prädien, Kutas, Lököshaza, Sofronya, Topilla. Sanktmartin, Austria : Heimatortsgemeinschaft Sanktmartin, 2011.

Anton Stumpf, birth estimated to be around 1700, came from Krautheim and died in Sanktmartin in 1744. The rest of the Stumpf entries are from his son, Johann Georg.

Anton is not in Stader’s Sammelwerk Stumpf entries. The Sanktmartin family book puts Anton in Elek around 1733 when was married and in Sanktmartin when his son was born in 1735, so really early!  

Sanktmartin, also called Arad St. Martin and Aradsanktmartin, is near the village of Elek, both of which were then in Arad county; now Sanktmartin is in Hungary and Elek is across the border in Romania. The Sanktmartin family book includes some, but not all Elek events. The FamilySearch website has indexed Elek church books. [2]  There are baptismal records for children of Joannes Stumpf and Margaretha (Anna Maria *1763), Adam Stumpf and Martha Langin (Josephum *1766 and Josephum *1769), and Petro Stumpf and Barbara Sturm (Anna Mariam *1770) and Johann Georg, who is in the Sanktmartin family book. Not sure why the others weren’t also included in the Sanktmartin family book.

The 1828 Hungarian Land Census lists several Stumpf individuals in Elek: Johan, Melchior, another Johan, Anna, Andre, Lorenz and Josef.

Conclusion: The Stumpf families in Elek are most likely from the same stock as the ones in Sanktmartin. Since they were in this region as early as 1733, it can be assumed that these Stumpf families are unrelated to Jakob and Melchior.

Glogowatz

I have reason to believe, but have forgotten why, that there are Stumpfs in Glogowatz. I have not yet investigated this.

Radna

According to the 1828 Hungarian Land Census, there is an Ignatz Stumpf in Radna. I have not yet investigated this either.  The name doesn't match any of the unaccounted for Stumpf sons.

Villages in Tolna County

Reviewing the digitized 1828 land census index for this post I found a bunch of other Stumpfs in Tolna County in: Bikacs (Joannes), Cziko (Joannes), Kakasd (Thad.), Nagy Szekely/Großsäckl (Henricus), Ozora (Gasparus), Udvari (Conradus). Tolna is in the region designated as Swabian Turkey and is west of the Banat.

This list is not extensive. There are Stumpfs in Hungary listed in other counties in the 1828 land census index.

Final Thought

Except for the Vilhelm/Wilhelm puzzle discussed earlier, the Stumpf families from these villages are also not connected to each other.  So although I was interested in any connections to Jakob and Melchior who went to Grabatz, I didn't see any connections between them.  They each had their own origin story.

Footnote:

[1] You can make requests from the FamilySearch Family History Library on their online request form. 

[2] FamilySearch has digitized church books for Elek.  You can also search the church books by clicking the magnifying glass next to the date range you are interested in.  The oldest ones cover 1734-1813.

Jakob and Melchior: What's Known from the Banat Side

Summarizing families and movements of Jakob and Melchior and asking questions.

After jumping over the brick wall of my Johann Stumpf (born 1838ish in Kathreinfeld), and I mean jumping over as in the wall remains, I put together hundreds of Stumpf families. Read about my descent into madness in How It Started and How It's Going.

The progenitors of my group of Stumpfs were Jakob and Melchior. They might have been brothers. This blog post is to summarize what I have gathered on these two men.

Where I Found the Pieces of the Puzzle:

Sources that shed light on Jakob and Melchior include Wilhelm & Kallbrunner's Quellen zur deutschen Siedlungsgeschichte in Südosteruropa [Sources for the History of German Settlement in Southeast Europe], the Stader series Sammelwerk Donauschwäbischer Kolonisten [Collection of Daunbe Schwaben Colonists] and family books for the villages of Kolut, Gakowa, Grabatz, Stefansfeld, Kathreinfeld, and Lazarfeld. I hit the jackpot this past year when I found Stumpf entries in a Kolut online family book by searching the Verein für Computergenealogie (compgen.de) website genealogy.net with their online village family books! (All the sources used are listed below in a Works Cited list after the footnotes.)

What I Have Learned and Deduced:

Sketching a Timeline

Based on these sources, here’s a timeline of Jakob and Melchior’s movements:

September 1764 & September 1765 Residence in Gakowa

Heading for the section with Jakob and Melchior, from Wilhelm & Kallbrunner's Quellen zur deutschen Siedlungsgeschichte in Südosteruropa, page 14 (FHL film 897413, image 442)

First appearance is on the Batschka Settlers List (Batscher Ansiedlungsliste) 1763 - 1768 (Wilhelm & Kallbrunner, 16). Both are listed as being residents of Gakova [1].
Melchior is listed with the date September 1764 and Jakob with September 1765.

Subheading for the village of Gakova (Gakovo), from Wilhelm & Kallbrunner's Quellen zur deutschen Siedlungsgeschichte in Südosteruropa, page 15, (FHL film 897413, image 442)

Jacobus Stumph [sic] and Melchior Stumpf on the list, from Wilhelm & Kallbrunner's Quellen zur deutschen Siedlungsgeschichte in Südosteruropa, page 16, (FHL film 897413, image 443)

Immigrants from southwest Germany, western France (Alsace and Lorraine), and even Luxembourg to the Hapsburg-held lands in Hungary were asked to register in Vienna, where they would be assigned to a village and given means to start a life in a new home.  Many immigrants for various reasons did not register in Vienna.  When I first found Jakob and Melchior in this work, I thought it was telling me they registered in Vienna on these dates. Upon further reflection while translating and pondering over the footnotes, I think this is actually a list of residents of Gakowa and not a Viennese registration.

Feb 1765 Marriage in Kolut

The Kolut online family book lists a February 1765 marriage of Melchior to Anna Maria Forvitt. Kolut is next to Gakowa. This was especially exciting because no where else in the other family books is her last name or their marriage date listed!

1764 & 1766 & 1767 Births in Gakowa

The online Kolut family book lists Jakob and Anna as having children born in Gakowa:

1. Margaretha in 1762
• Margaretha is probably born elsewhere, including before they immigrated
2. Johann Adam in August 1764
• Johann Adam was baptized in August 1764 in Kolut
3. Martin in 1767
• Martin was born approximately in 1767, but cited from a Status Animarum and not a baptism record

Melchior and Maria Anna have one son listed in the online Kolut family book and one son is listed in the Grabatz family book and church records:

1. Lorenz (born June 1766 in Gakowa, baptized in June 1766 in Kolut)
2. Johann Adam (born approx. 1767 in Gakowa from his death entry in 1775 in Grabatz)

Gakowa Family Book lists:

• Jakob with wife Katharina and the three children (other sources list Jakob's wife as Anna)
• Melchior and wife Maria Anna with no children
• Eva Elisabeth, with unnamed parents, born about 1754; perhaps a sister to Jakob and Melchior?

1769 in Grabatz

The Stumpf families had moved to Grabatz by August 1769 when Melchior’s daughter's baptism is recorded in the church book. Jakob is noted in the Grabatz church books with his marriage to Sabine in 1772.

Stader’s Sammelwerk notes that Melchior is on the Grabatz settlers list in 1770 as 1 man, 1 woman, and 1 child age 11-17. His living sons, Lorenz and Johann Adam would have been 5 and 4 years old, respectively. Perhaps they didn’t count the little ones? Not sure if he had older children?? Perhaps not his child, but a foster or servant? But really, his estimated birth year of 1742 would eliminate him from having a child between the age of 11-17 in 1770. This could be Eva Elisabeth from the Gakowa family book, approximately age 16 in 1770, and possibly his sister.

The two men spent the rest of their lives in Grabatz. Jakob died there in 1810, his wife Sabine died there in 1811. Melchior died there in 1818 and his wife Maria Anna died in Lazarfeld in 1827.

The last Stumpf family event in Grabatz happened in June 1819. The families moved on.  More on this in my next blog installment.

Where did these men come from?

Jakob’s Birth and Origin Clues

Birth is estimated to be 1745 in the Grabatz family book (most likely based on his recorded age at death) but estimated to be born in 1739 in the Gakowa and Kolut family books. The 1739 date is from earlier records, so likely more correct.  Sources list his origin as being from the "Reich" and from "Pfalz."

Melchior’s Birth and Origin Clues

Melchior is estimated to be born about 1742 across all the sources. The Grabatz family book lists Pfalz as birthplace, but the Stefansfeld family book and the Kühn Lazarfeld family book list Schwaben as birthplace. Stader's Sammelwerk only lists "Reich."

Family Groups Based on All the Clues

In family group form, here is a summary of what I have discovered and determined [2]:

STUMPF Jakob
  *abt 1739 or 1745 “Pfalz”/"Reich"        †16 May 1810 Grabatz
  Ꝏ
  NN Anna or Katharina
  *abt 1746
    1. Margaretha     *abt 1762
    2. Adam           ~15 Aug 1764 Kolut    †24 Jan 1822 Zichydorf
    3. Martin         *abt 1767
  Ꝏ 06 Oct 1772 Grabatz
  LONGIN Sabine

  *abt 1741  Lorraine                       †21 Oct 1811 Grabatz
    4. Margaretha     *28 Jul 1773 Grabatz  †18 Feb 1778 Grabatz
    5. Elisabeth      *19 Sep 1775 Grabatz  †24 Aug 1776 Grabatz
    6. Jakob          *03 Jun 1777 Grabatz  †11 Jun 1777 Grabatz
    7. Johann Michael *22 Jun 1778 Grabatz
    8. Jakob          *25 Oct 1780 Grabatz  †       1859 Stefansfeld
    9. Anton          *17 Jun 1783 Grabatz  †06 Jun 1784 Grabatz


STUMPF Melchior
  *abt 1742 “Pfalz” or “Schwaben”/"Reich"   †29 Nov 1818 Grabatz
  Ꝏ 17 Feb 1765 Kolut
  FORVITT Maria Anna
  *abt 1741                                 †29 Nov 1827 Lazarfeld
    1. Lorenz         *   Jun 1766 Gakowa/~24 Jun 1766 Kolut
    2. Johann Adam    *   abt 1767 Gakowa   †31 May 1775 Grabatz
    3. Franziska      *10 Aug 1769 Grabatz  †14 Aug 1769 Grabatz
    4. Jakob          *29 Oct 1770 Grabatz  †25 Jan 1806 Grabatz
    5. Elisabeth      *02 Feb 1773 Grabatz
    6. Johann Adam    *25 May 1775 Grabatz
    7. Margaretha     *16 Apr 1776 Grabatz  †23 Apr 1776 Grabatz
    8. Anna Maria     *28 May 1777 Grabatz
    9. Johann Adam    *15 Feb 1780 Grabatz
   10. Barbara        *15 Feb 1781 Grabatz  †12 Jun 1781 Grabatz
   11. Katharina      *29 Jun 1782 Grabatz
   12. Adam           *22 Dec 1785 Grabatz  † 25 Jun 1786 Grabatz


STUMPF Eva Elisabeth
  *abt 1754

Comment on Johann Adam

Melchior has three sons named Johann Adam.  Yes, three.  Oh, and another son named Adam.  In the Grabatz family book, the death in 1775 of Johann Adam was attributed to the second Johann Adam, but the entry in the church book indicates he was 8 years old when he died, which would mean it was the first Johann Adam.  Stader's Sammelwerk agrees with this assessment.  The fates of the other Johann Adams are unknown.

Missing Info

• The death of Jakob’s wife Anna or Katharina, presumably before Oct 1772.

• The deaths or other information of some of their children, especially Jakob’s son Martin and Melchior’s sons Lorenz and the two Johann Adams.  Did they die on the move to Grabatz, die in Grabatz, or live to adulthood and move somewhere I haven't found them?

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Footnotes

[1] Gakowa is the German name for the village.  It was also known as Gakova.  It is currently called Gakovo and is in Serbia.

[2] I'm using the format used in the family books, including the symbols * for birth; ~ for baptized; ꝏ for marriage; † for death.

Works Used to Compile Jakob and Melchior’s Families

If any researcher would like copies of scans I have or direct links to online sources, let me know.

Awender, Hans, compiler. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Stephansfeld, Banat, 1796-1945: Vorfahren und Nachfahren. Salzburg, Austria: Stephansfelder Heimatausschuß, 1998.

Bayer, Johann. "Ortsfamilienbuch Kolut." Online family book. Verein für Computergenealogie e.V. (CompGen). Genealogy.net. https://www.online-ofb.de/kolut: 2021.

Hl. Maria von der immerwährenden Hilfe [St. Mary of the Perpetual Help] (Grabatz, Torontál, Hungary). Kirchenbuch, 1768-1881. Digitized Microfilm. Family History Library, Salt Lake City, Utah, http:/familysearch.org : 2021.

Ivanov, Alfred, compiler. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Grabatz: 1768-2008. N.p.: HOG Grabatz, 2008.

Kühn, Josef. Familienbuch der katholischen Pfarrgemeinde Lazarfeld im Banat : und ihrer Filialen Klel (KkL.) und Jankahid (Jhd.): 1800-1834/1852. Villingen-Schwenningen, Germany: Josef Kühn und Arbeitsgemeinschaft für Veröffentlichung Banater Familienbücher, 2004.

Schnaterbeck, Johann and Michael Hutfluss, compilers. Ortssippenbuch Gakowa (Gákova, Gakovo, Gádor): Batschka. 2 volumes. Kornwestheim, Germany: Heimatortsgemeinschaft Gakowa, 1994.

Stader, Stefan, compiler. Sammelwerk Donauschwäbischer Kolonisten. 9 volumes. Sindelfingen, Germany: Donauschwäbischer Familienforscher, 1997-2017.

Wilhelm, Franz and Josef Kallbrunner. Quellen zur deutschen Siedlungsgeschichte in Südosteuropa. Munich: Reinhardt, 1936. Digitized microfilm 897413 is available at FamilySearch at https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/48684.