Brick Walls and Loose Branches: Stumpf Men with Unknown Parentage

This post and the last post are lists of Stumpf boys and men who have brick walls.

Mixing Metaphors

In the previous post, I listed several Stumpf boys who disappear from the records.  I don’t know what happened to them.  They are on the other side of the brick wall, meaning coming forward in time they disappear.

This blog addresses this side of the brick wall, going back in time and hitting a wall.  Mixing metaphors, I have a list of unconnected branches that I don't have enough information to graft them onto the main Stumpf family tree. 

Graphic on how to graft a branch onto a tree.  Looks easy enough.
From www.wikigreen.org via Eric Blazek

Note: In this list, I skipped all the women with unknown parents: the unmarried Stumpf mothers who had children that got the Stumpf name and families with Stumpf mothers with other surnames.

Here is a partial list of Stumpf men, sorted by village and estimated date of birth.  

When estimating date of birth with known birthdate of child, I assumed only the man was at least 18, so my estimations are the earliest he would be born.  He could easily be 5 years older than my estimate and maybe up to 20 years older.

Many are husbands and fathers, one joined the military, and two completed WWI draft registration cards in the U.S.  Do any of these match up with the boys from the other list?  Maybe one.

Kathreinfeld

Franz Stumpf married to Eva Klein

• Their first kid was born in 1843 in Kathreinfeld puts an estimate of him being born before 1825.
• Franz will be the topic of a future post.

Franz married to Anna Rein

• He was born about 1848 in Kathreinfeld; their first known kid was born in 1876 in Kathreinfeld.
• This Franz will also be mentioned in a future post.

My Johann married to Katharina Hoffmann

• He was born in Kathreinfeld, estimated in 1838 based on age at death; his wife was born in Klek; their children were born in Kathreinfeld and maybe the first one in Klek.
• I wonder if this is the son of Johann [Michael] and  Anna Maria Putz born in Kathreinfeld in 1841.
• The church books have been searched for their marriage and has not been found.  The prevailing theory currently is that the marriage happened in the years of missing records in Klek, the dreaded Gap Years.

Jakob

• He was born about 1843 in Kathreinfeld and joined the 29th Infantry Regiment in 1864.
• 1843 is just as the Gap Years are starting.

Johann married to Theresia Krieger

• Their two kids were born and died young in Kathreinfeld, the first in 1863.  This puts an estimate of him being born before 1845.

Jakob married to Anna Meckl

• He was born about 1852 in Kathreinfeld; their first kids were born in Kathreinfeld.

Michael married to Anna Budo

• He was born about 1856 in Kathreinfeld and died in 1937.  
• There is a big mausoleum in Kathreinfeld cemetery with their names on the entryway.  It is about the only thing you can see in the Kathreinfeld old cemetery because it was so overgrown.  When we visited in 2009, there was path to the entrance.  The coffins appeared to have been opened and vandalized - or junk was thrown in the mausoleum.

The Michael Stumpf & Anna Budo Mausoleum
in Kathreinfeld in 2009.  Note the horrible overgrowth!
Photo by Trish Stumpf Garcia.

Johann married to Margaretha

• His son Peter was born in 1883 and died in 1886 in Kathreinfeld.  This puts an estimate of Johann being born before 1865.

Klek

Nikolaus married to Anna Holz

• He was born about 1862 in Klek.

Johann married to Juliana Podvin

• He was born in Klek; his wife and kids were born in Großbetschkerek.  Juliana was born in 1872, so he is likely this age or older.

Caspar married to Eva Kolleth

• He was born in Klek and married in Belgrade in 1925; their kids were born in Großbetschkerek. His wife was born in 1903, so he is likely this age or older.
• To-do List: look for Belgrade 1925 marriages.  
• FamilySearch only has records for the Armenian Apostolic Church in this timeframe.
• MyHeritage doesn't have Serbian records.
• Ancestry doesn't have needed Serbian records.
• Ok, scratch that.  It looks like this would be an archives search.

St. Georgen

Nikolaus married to Katharina Klaszki

• His son Ladislaus was born about 1889 in St. Georgen puts an estimate of him being born before 1871.

Johann, Michael married to Katalin, and Julianna married to Bernad Bichler (siblings)

• Michael born about 1878 in St. Georgen and immigrated to the US in 1909. 
• The siblings, Johann and Julianna also seem to have also immigrated to the US.

Stefansfeld

Martin married to Maria Anna

• His son Nikolaus was born in Stefansfeld in 1853.  That would put Martin at being born before 1835.

Nikolaus married to Margaretha Merle

• Their first child born in 1879 in Stefansfeld puts an estimate of him being born before 1861.

Nikolaus married to Margaretha Schirmann

• They married in Stefansfeld; their kids were born in Stefansfeld starting in 1874.

John 

• He was born 15 Mar 1887 in Stefansfeld and immigrated to the US.  He completed a WWI draft registration card in Chicago.

Josef

• He was born 18 Feb 1894 in Stefansfeld and immigrated to the US.  He completed WWI draft registration card in Sebewaing, Michigan.

Peter married to Anna Rettinger

• Anna died in 1944 in Stefansfeld.  No clues as to age.

Karlsdorf

Johann married to Elisabeth Farkas

• His son was born in Karlsdorf in 1902.  Johann would have been born before 1884.
• Johann is probably from somewhere other than Karlsdorf.

Kühlenburg/Lazarfeld

Peter married to Margaretha Rumber

• His son Bernhard was born in “Kühlenburg” according to the Lazarfeld family book by Repp (2008).  No dates associated with the entry, so no idea when Peter was born.  Also, not sure why this information is in the Lazarfeld family book.

Some Thoughts on Who These Men Were

They are mostly many generations after the immigration of Jakob and Melchior in 1764 to Austria-Hungary.  Some of these might be young men moving to a different village to get married and raise their families, but not all.  Many of these are falling in the gap years of Kathreinfeld or St. Georgen, i.e. mid-1840s to 1870s.  I know I have families in the database with unaccounted for children in those years as well.   

Behind the Brick Wall: List of Stumpf Boys Who "Disappear"

This post and the next post are lists of Stumpf boys and men who have brick walls.

*NO DATA EXCEPT BIRTH*

In compiling the early generations of descendants of the brothers Jakob and Melchior Stumpf in the Banat, I came across several children who had a birth/baptism entry, but no other information.  In my database, I marked them with a death location of *NO DATA EXCEPT BIRTH* so I could find them easily with a search.  I then added the brick wall image with a question mark as their profile picture, so I could identify them at a glance in their families.  

I was hoping as I dug in deeper, I would be able to close out some of these brick walls.  These are the names from the first few generations that I so far cannot connect with their fates, although I do have a guess on one of them.  These are only from the first few generations.  There are lots of people in the later generations I also don't know their fates, however, I felt the earlier generations were foundational to building the tree of this Stumpf family.  I’m left wondering if these unaccounted for Stumpf boys died young or grew to adulthood and moved away to a village whose records I haven't accessed or joined the military.

Profile picture for boy whose fate is unknown. Image created by author from clipart.

List of Missing Boys

Here is a list of the boys that are brick walls coming forward in time, grouped by families.  (To see the family groups for Jakob and Melchior, see Jakob and Melchior: What's Known from the Banat Side.)

Son of Jakob and earlier wife, either Katharina or Anna.

Martin was born about 1767.  No baptism entry found and I suspect the name comes from the Settler’s list where he is listed with sister Margaretha and brother Johann Adam.  Margaretha was born in Dörlesberg before they immigrated. Johann Adam was baptized in 1764 in Kolut with a birth noted as Gakowa.

• Did Martin die in Gakowa and that was not recorded, or maybe on the move to Grabatz?
• Did he exists at all?

Sons of Jakob’s son Johann Michael and wife Magdalena Krämer 

Josef born 21 Jan 1806 in Grabatz

Jakob born 12 Mar 1824 in Stefansfeld

Son of Jakob’s son Jakob and wife Elisabeth Unterreiner

Jakob born 10 Dec 1803 in Stefansfeld

Sons of Melchior and Maria Anna

Lorenz born June 1766 in Gakowa and baptized in Kolut.

• Did he die in Gakowa and it wasn’t recorded, or maybe on the move to Grabatz?

Johann Adam was born 25 May 1775 in Grabatz

(Another) Johann Adam was born 15 Feb 1780 in Grabatz

Son of Melchior’s son Jakob and Katharina Bartl

Michael born 26 Jul 1803 in Grabatz

Son of Melchior’s grandson Peter and Anna Maria Neurohr

Friedrich born 28 May 1829 in Kathreinfeld

• There are some Franz Stumpfs who are not connected to their birth families who I'll list in the next post, but this one seems to be not the right age, too young for one and too old for the other to be either of them.  Also, the nickname for Friedrich is probably Fritz and not Franz.

Son of Melchior’s great-grandson (and Peter’s son) Johann [Michael] and Anna Maria Putz

Johann born 15 Jul 1841 in Kathreinfeld.

• This actually might be my 3x-great-grandfather who married Katharina Hoffmann
• With a birth of 1841, Johann would definitely be affected by the gap in records of Kathreinfeld. 

Jakob and Melchior: Their Descendants

The previous blog post followed Jakob and Melchior Stumpf from Gakowa to Grabatz. This post looks at their sons, grandsons, and great-grandsons tracking where the families went after leaving Grabatz.

Villages Full of Stumpfs

There are several villages in the Banat that have large numbers of Stumpf families.  Figuring out how they all fit together, if they fit together, and where they came from might help me figure out how my ancestor Johann (born about 1838) connects to the rest of them.

Jakob’s Descendants

Jakob lived in Grabatz from at least 1772 until he died in 1810.

Jakob's sons' families went to Zichydorf and Stefansfeld.

Jakob's son Adam moved to Zichydorf between 1789 and 1792, before his father’s death. Adam's son, Johann Peter, also stayed in Zichydorf.

Johann Michael is the next surviving son of Jakob. He moves to Stefansfeld between 1819 and 1821. The family stays in Stefansfeld with a few grandsons moving to Sartscha.

Jakob’s last (surviving to adulthood) son, Jakob, married in Grabatz, spent a few years in Stefansfeld, moved to Zichydorf for a few years, but moved back to Stefansfeld to stay. One of his grandsons moved on to Setschan.

Melchior’s Descendants

Melchior lived in Grabatz from at least 1770 until he died in 1818.  His widow died in Lazarfeld nine years later on the same date.  

Only one son is known to survive to adulthood: Jakob (*1770). There are three sons whose fate is unknown. Lorenz (*1766), Johann Adam (*1775), and Johann Adam (*1780). In some family books, Johann Adam (*1780) was assigned as a groom of Elisabeth Unterreiner before she married a son of Jakob. No marriage record was found in the Grabatz church book, so I'm assuming this was a compilation error.

Melchior's grandsons went to Kathreinfeld and Klek.

The one surviving son, Jakob (*1770) who died in 1806 at 36 years old, had two sons: Peter and Jakob. Peter went to Kathreinfeld and Jakob went to Klek. This is also captured in the 1828 Census, which recorded landowners.  Peter's sons stayed in Kathreinfeld.  Some of Jakob's sons stayed in Klek and two moved to Deutsch Etschka with one of them dying in Sigmundfeld.

Please enjoy this graphic

To better visualize the movement of the Stumpf family, I created this graphic.  

Note: Dates of moves are approximate and based on dates of known events. Only males known to have families are shown, since the Stumpf surname was the priority of this exercise. In cases where the year of death is unknown, there are alternating colored and uncolored boxes with a question mark in the final box.  In cases where the year of death is known, the colored bar ends with a cross in the death year column.

 

Here's a link to a pdf version for your perusal.

Update 20 Mar 2023: Corrected spelling of Stefansfeld.